Get elected, get a free car!
Former WYOU news director Frank Andrews is one of 23 new state representatives who is getting the perks of taxpayer-funded transportation. The Philadelphia Inquirer finds many freshman lawmakers in Harrisburg have opted for leased vehicles, funded with taxpayer dollars, instead of being reimbursed for mileage. Andrews' choice is a 2004 Dodge Durango, at a cost of $439 per month.
In all fairness, a lease could be cheaper than being reimbursed for the miles to and from Harrisburg. And Andrews isn't the only NEPA legislator driving a leased vehicle up and down Interstate 81. But after last year's payraise debacle, you'd think the politicians in Harrisburg would think twice before lining up to the trough o' freebies.
UPDATE: Blog reader Tom Carten notes that Andrews picked the Durango because there wasn't much of a choice left. And as I noted, it turns out the lease is cheaper than mileage reimbursement.
In all fairness, a lease could be cheaper than being reimbursed for the miles to and from Harrisburg. And Andrews isn't the only NEPA legislator driving a leased vehicle up and down Interstate 81. But after last year's payraise debacle, you'd think the politicians in Harrisburg would think twice before lining up to the trough o' freebies.
UPDATE: Blog reader Tom Carten notes that Andrews picked the Durango because there wasn't much of a choice left. And as I noted, it turns out the lease is cheaper than mileage reimbursement.
posted by Howard Beale at 5:48 PM
46 Comments:
If you look, most other lawmakers from our area are leasing cars that cost around $250 a month. Frank's is almost twice that amount. Nothing but the best!
Yeah, why don't we just make him walk! Or hitch-hike!
Join me now in the old sing-along favorite: "Heyna, I'm a retiree livin' on a fixed income and ain't nobody givin' me no car." And then let's wonder why most people avoid political life and public service like the plague.
Do you honestly believe Frank left broadcasting (and a pretty decent salary) so he could get rich at 48 1/2 cents a mile? Frank's losing money in the legislature. He's in it to do good.
Frank's been driving "beaters" for years: wrecks that couldn't possibly make it through the hills to Harrisburg on a wintry day.
A 2004 Dodge Durango sounds like it can make the trip--and it's three years old, for chrissakes. Hardly a blatant pocketing of taxpayers' dollars.
Tell Frank a friend of mine has a 2004 Durango. It comes factory equipped with a special feature, it stops at every second gas station it passes automatically. If he has to pay for the gas he might wish he went with the mileage deal. That's a lot of vehicle making the run back and forth to Harrisburg with no load in the trailer.
Andrews' choice is a 2004 Dodge Durango.
9:01 -- I'd not say it's "nothing but the best." It's three years old. I wonder what the $439/month gets him? Sat radio? In-car phone? Other high-end packages?
Good 'Ole Frankie!!!
His hypocrasy and lies come right out at the starting gate. Didn't he run on a platform of responsibility with taxpayer money?
439-DOLLARS!!!! He is such a user! That's alot of money (our money), Frank to spend on a car. Thanks for giving it to the taxpayers up the ***! But, then that is what you did to people you worked with in the TV business. Some things never change
That's a HUGE lease on a USED car! You can get a 2007 Jeep Liberty for $169/mo... 2007 Grand Cherokee for $209/mo... (both in today's paper) shall I go on!? WTF??!! That's craziness!! Who approves that crap??!! Why wouldn't you shop around? If he can't even make a decent deal on a car, how could he make decent decisions on behalf of his district?? "In it to do good..." how do you figure??!
What it not known is that Frank & the freshmen must choose from a very short list which car they would like. The decision of what type & how much to pay is made for them. Look at the list and notice MOST of them are used and from 2003/4. Don't blame Frank, it just depends on when he received the list & what cars were left on it for him top pick from.
Now that I think of it, do these people have to justify their car deals? For instance, if you have a longer ride, do you get a larger allowance? Do all the deals work out to approximately the same when all is said and done?
I'm not much into the political scene, but I can't see someone being that far out of the norm and getting away with it.
Here's what Frank said, in reply to my e-mail request:
Thanks for asking Tom.
I took the state lease program because it is the most cost effective. I can only use the car for business and I pay the state for personal use.
The missing element on the blog is this. At orientation they passed a list around of available used cars. By the time it got to the P's for Ed Pashinski and S's for Shimkus, there was not much left. I did want an SUV to drive down 81 but had no choices.
By the way, that car has 52,000 miles and the rule is you must keep it for 100,000.
(End of message.)
Like Howard said, Frank's not the only one taking advantage of this. I'd like to see a list of the other ones.
Indead a lease is cheaper than by-the-mile reimbursement. This is why Penn State Hazleton now rents from Enterprise when faculty or staff must travel to the University Park campus at State College.
Fleet leasing would likely cut the cost of this in half. That, of course, can't happen under the current "norms" because our boys and girls in Harrisburg voted themselves a $650 per month auto lease perk. That also explains why some older cars are in this mix - a rep leases an Escalade for $650 per month, then gets un-elected. The state is now responsible for the lease, so it goes into the pool and some lucky legislator gets it.
However you slice, dice, twist, and turn it, taxpayers are on the hook for getting these esteemed public servants back and forth to Harrisburg. And let us not overlook the per diem they collect for each and every day they are in Harrisburg; is it $125(I could be underdone)per day? That means any one of these citizens can rent one heck of an apartment in Harrisburg on the taxpayers' dime along with the free car. That would be based on them being in Dauphin County 16 days a month, roughly 10 months a year. That's $250 per week, $1000 a month, etc. Factor in the salary, and if you have a taste for it, it ain't a bad deal at all.
P.S. Most state reps are in Harrisburg less than three days a week, so that would eat into that per diem.
And what's with Air Force One? Can't the President fly in a Cessna? Who does HE think HE is?
quote
"Heyna, I'm a retiree livin' on a fixed income and ain't nobody givin' me no car." And then let's wonder why most people avoid political life and public service like the plague"
end quote
if you don't like the system get involved and fix it or be quite. I allways find it funny that people say they hate politicians but they do not vote or do not get involved. in my oponion if you don't get involved or don't vote you should loose the right to complaine about it.
Here's my take. How many regular citizens, working class people get car leases paid by employers? Not many. I don't care if the guy was on the lower end of the list and wound up with a Durango. Pennsylvania is one of the few states that provide this perk. In effect, taxpayers, you and I are paying for this. State Legislators should be treated as professionals and a starting salary of $71,000 should be enough for any Representative to relieve himself of a "beater". In Lackawanna and Luzerne County, there are many members of a new class "the working poor" that can only dream of a $71,000 plus paycheck. Ken Smith didn't take the car perk. The late Bob Casey, Senior stayed in a rented room (Monday thru Thursday) in Lemoyne, Pa. for eight years when he was Auditor General. Granted, that was 1969 to 1977 but he raised 8 kids on a salary substantially less than the $71,000 and used his own car.
David Yonki
Quick question. Does EVERYONE have to justify EVERY move EVERY TIME Tom Carten posts to ANY blog written ANYWHERE in the free world?
I was going to ask, "Who appointed YOU God?" but I think he's got an answer.
Still, didn't the "Big Guy" say something about "judge not?" Give it a rest, whydoncha. Think about being "Anonymous" once in awhile. Get a (nonjudgmental) life.
People, please read the articles linked before lambasting the guy.
Yes, a brand new car can be leased much cheaper. But as the article says, the lease price also includes insurance and maintenance. You can't get that for $169 a month at the Jeep dealership. And when on business, you are supposed to be covered by your employer, so it makes sense that insurance and maintenance is covered. Remember, these vehicles are for business use only; personal use must be paid for by the representative.
Also, if you read the article, you'll find that the cars out there aren't loaded with bells and whistles. There was mention of one Explorer with cloth seats and no CD player.
Assuming it's 100 miles to Harrisburg from Scranton, each trip to and from the capitol would cost $98 to reimburse. Even if he only makes one trip per week, that's $400 a month. And if only one trip per week, then you either don't have your representative in town to hear your opinion, or you don't have your representative in the Capitol voting.
So, it's not completely horrible when you really think about it. It probably will end up saving the taxpayers money in the long run.
Originally posted by Anonymous at 11:14 AM:
"That's a HUGE lease on a USED car! You can get a 2007 Jeep Liberty for $169/mo... 2007 Grand Cherokee for $209/mo... (both in today's paper) shall I go on!? WTF??!! That's craziness!! Who approves that crap??!! Why wouldn't you shop around? If he can't even make a decent deal on a car, how could he make decent decisions on behalf of his district?? "In it to do good..." how do you figure??!"
Most likely that $169/month Liberty lease only allowed 10,000 miles per year with substantial per mile penalties beyond the 10,000 mile point.
Let's say Frank A.'s has a 75 mile commute from home to H'burg (150 miles roundtrip). A 5 day workweek would put him at the 10,000 mile lease limit in 13 weeks. A 4 day workweek caps out at 16 weeks.
I don't fully understand the state vehicle leasing program. Yeah, there's probably someone making money here, but the general leasing idea is sound. As for how the legislature or vehicle services runs it, is another story.
7:44 -- Quick question. Does EVERYONE have to justify EVERY move EVERY TIME Tom Carten posts to ANY blog written ANYWHERE in the free world? I was going to ask, "Who appointed YOU God?" but I think he's got an answer.
The only reason I wrote to Frank was to get to the source. I don't care what the answer is; I just wanted to cut through the opinions and find out what Frank himself had to say.
Maybe his choice is right; maybe it's wrong. Maybe he can afford to pay his own way; maybe not. But until I asked him for his side, nobody bothered to ask for his thoughts.
I'm not God, but just someone who wants to check Prime Sources.
Granted, that was 1969 to 1977 but he raised 8 kids on a salary substantially less than the $71,000 and used his own car.
Well, okay, I feel almost guilty saying this, because I was a huge fan of the governor - but he did not raise a family on the guv's salary alone. Mr. Casey was a member of a very prestigious Philadelphia law firm(Dillworth Paxson)prior to being elected, and I believe held an interest in the firm while governor, although that may have been placed in a blind trust. FWIW, Chris Casey, son of the governor and unsuccessful congressional candidate, now works for that same firm.
Were the Caseys wealthy? Perhaps not. Were they comfortable? Very much so.
"if you don't like the system get involved and fix it or be quite."
12:25 AM
OK, I'll be "quite" about it. Quite what?
"in my oponion if you don't get involved or don't vote you should loose the right to complaine about it."
12:25 AM
And as we all know, loose rights sink "quites." It stinks, I tell ya--just like an op-onion. Bute whoe ame Ie toe "complaine?"
Actually, the point of my post was that I support the system of granting lawmakers an auto allowance.
I was being fah-see-shush (have someone spell it for you, then look it up).
It's called Legislative perks, it's part of the job... Get a life and stop bitching. That's the problem with NE PA... No one can ever have anything better the the next guy. You get a new car and people say, "Oh it must be nice".. You get a better job, "Oh, who did he bl^%"
Life is too short...Get over it!
What I just don't get is that you make a big salary at a job, how is it the taxpayers responsibility to get you there? Even people who get paid commission usually only get reimbursed for mileage while ON THE JOB, not mileage to get to and from work. It is a position they apply for, know that it's 100 miles away in Harrisburg, and should deal with that issue themselves. I wonder if it would weed out the greedy politicians if some of these "perks" were taken away, and they were no longer the extra incentives... you'd actually be running for the true purpose of the position!
Quick question. Does EVERYONE have to justify EVERY move EVERY TIME Tom Carten posts to ANY blog written ANYWHERE in the free world?
Call me dense but I don't understand your question. I do know that I regard Tom Carten's observations on various blogs, my own included, as informative, insghtful and funny. Besides bringing a wealth of experience in media and life to blogs, Tom signs his own name to them. When I first started The LuLac Political Letter in May of '06, I thought no one was out there. Tom's comments were very much welcomed. While I embrace anonymous opinions and publish almost everyone I get, it's refreshing to see a guy back up his many opinions with his name and rep.
"Call me dense but I don't understand your question."
4:22 PM
OK, you're dense. Let me explain it to you.
Fr. Tom's first post on this thread started the piling on, questioning that maybe Shimkus is soaking the populace for "Sat radio? In-car phone? Other high-end packages?"
Next up, it's time to play judge and jury: "I'm not much into the political scene, but I can't see someone being that far out of the norm and getting away with it."
Then, and only then, does he ask Frank about it. What do we get from Rep. Shimkus? A straightforward explanation of a system he didn't create but has to live with. Don't like the system? Contact your representative in Harrisburg and demand that it be changed. Hell, your Rep. might even be Frank "Andrews" Shimkus. Hell, he might be the "cure" (if one is needed). He sure ain't the cause.
Frank, watch your back. With friends like the good padre...well, you know the rest.
In response to 10:09PM. He is the President. Don't care if you hate him but please respect the Office. Yes, AF-1 is part of the deal.
Let's remember one thing here, folks. Politics used to be about "public service." Now it's a fucking career choice, often populated by people who couldn't get and retain a real job elsewhere.
Who does the "president think he is?" Don't even go there.
Now, there's a lot of bad climate change news on various MSM Web sites today. Will state legislators in Harrisburg act now and set the example? By camping out in Harrisburg and talking to constituents by telephone and e-mail rather than driving hither and yon? Of course not. That would entail the use of common sense.
Keep in mind, please, that Tom has a level of protection that most of us do not, which is why anonymity is crucial to the continuance of this and other blogs. While it is certainly up to the reader to judge what's true and what isn't, there'd be little here to read if revealing one's identity was required.
Dear 5:23 ... sigh... Fr. Tom's first post on this thread started the piling on, questioning that maybe Shimkus is soaking the populace for "Sat radio? In-car phone? Other high-end packages?"
Yep, that was my first thought. He's got a long ride and, therefore, does he qualify for sat radio and a few other things. Thinking out loud and asking the populace on the board. No piling on; just wondering and not getting an answer.
Next up, it's time to play judge and jury: "I'm not much into the political scene, but I can't see someone being that far out of the norm and getting away with it."
Thinking more, as the thread develops, that perhaps there are bottom-line norms and as long as you fit into them (i.e.: lousy car allows you some other perks, or you can balance mileage against lease) and stay within agreed-upon boundaries, it's ok.
Then, and only then, does he ask Frank about it.
Well?? Where the eff were all of you brilliant tv reporters and anchors? Don't you guys and gals ever think of checking prime sources? Do I have to wait until it's obvious nobody at 16 and 50 will do that? That's why I waited.
What do we get from Rep. Shimkus?
The chance to explain what people on this blog are bouncing around without benefit of the involved person's voice.
Frank, watch your back. With friends like the good padre...well, you know the rest.
Yeah, without friends like me, you people would still be giving your opinions without benefit of hearing his.
* * *
Keep in mind, please, that Tom has a level of protection that most of us do not, which is why anonymity is crucial to the continuance of this and other blogs.
A very important point to keep in mind. I've said before that many of you would get whipped just for showing up here, much less saying something negative about your company. I realize that and I applaud those who take the chance that they may be found out.
I have already told one of you that if you can't post directly because of some problem, you can do it through me (as "anonymous") and I will post it for you, your anonymity guaranteed same as the Seal of Confession. ...and maybe I have already...
Let me explain it to you.
Okay, thanks. I got the chronology now.
which is why anonymity is crucial to the continuance of this and other blogs.
Very true, and appreciated. once I enabled those anonymous comments, I got more responses on my political blog, the LuLac Political Letter.
Shimkus(and all the other "I'll be different" reps and senators)may not have created the car leasing system, but not one of them is under any obligation to play the game - Shimkus could've declined the car, declined the mileage expense, or done whatever else he wanted to do. Like all the rest of them, he shrugged his shoulders and simply went along with the program, blaming it on those who created it.
The lease is cheaper than mileage reimbursement like Rep Smith chose. Lawmakers are in Harrisburg about three nights per week...if your employer requires you to travel for an overnight stay, most will provide the lodging and meals. I think it's fair that the state does this for representatives. What I am interested in is seeing the freshmen vote for reform and open up the secretive process in Hburg. If Shimkus and Smith do that and work for the people, I could care less what kind of car they drive.
"In response to 10:09PM. He is the President. Don't care if you hate him but please respect the Office. Yes, AF-1 is part of the deal."
5:24 PM
In response to your response: Frank Andrews is a State Representative. Don't care if you hate him but please respect the office. Yes, a car is part of the deal.
See, sarcasm DOES work and it DID prove my point.
Next topic: Republicans have no sense of humor. Discuss amongst yourselves.
barf
Sorry, Tom: your arguments still don't pass muster. "Thinking out loud" doesn't seem, to me at least, to be a good excuse for smearing someone.
You presumed (and stated) guilt--then allowed Shimkus his day in what turned out to be your court. Where I come from that's backwards. That's why I'm slow to rush to judgment.
If I'm guilty of one thing, it's singling you out. Trust me, my condemnation extends to most of the posters here--to the very first poster, 9:01 AM--and to 9:50 AM--11:14 AM--and many, many other holier-than-thou types. You should all be ashamed of yourselves.
Trust me, my condemnation extends to most of the posters here--to the very first poster, 9:01 AM--and to 9:50 AM--11:14 AM--and many, many other holier-than-thou types
Simple solution - don't come here. We express opinions, right or wrong, they are opinions. Before you go, let me ask you this; isnt' Holier-Than-Thou what the good reverend "doctor" is all about? Take notice that he has dropped any and all mention of that fake doctorate he has.
8:07 -- Take notice that he has dropped any and all mention of that fake doctorate he has.
I forget the exact details, but is it a fake doctorate, or simply from a non-accredited school? I remember it coming up here during the election process. I know one of the schools he went to is a legit place, but simply does not participate in the accreditation process.
6:40 -- Sorry, Tom: your arguments still don't pass muster. "Thinking out loud" doesn't seem, to me at least, to be a good excuse for smearing someone. You presumed (and stated) guilt--then allowed Shimkus his day in what turned out to be your court. Where I come from that's backwards. That's why I'm slow to rush to judgment.
You make a good point. I keep thinking of these places (message boards) as bars where you can come in, express an opinion, get shot down, revise your thoughts, etc. I did not mean it to be the way you see it. But if you want to see kangaroo courts, just go back to when Frank announced for office. My mistake looks just as it ended up; by comparison, Frank got roasted, toasted and rolled in salt.
I keep thinking of these places (message boards) as bars where you can come in, express an opinion, get shot down, revise your thoughts, etc.
Yeah, but in the corner bar your conversation can't be overheard (and taken as gospel) in Tucumcari, Anchorage, Butte, Jacksonville and Montepelier.
You're right about one thing: Frank absolutely got RAPED here when he announced his candidacy. Maybe people should think to themselves before they "think out loud."
5:17 said-- Yeah, but in the corner bar your conversation can't be overheard (and taken as gospel) in Tucumcari, Anchorage, Butte, Jacksonville and Montepelier.
Well taken, well taken. I gotta watch that; sorry. There *is* a camera and a mic in the bar on the internet. You should see what I don't post because my name is on it!
but is it a fake doctorate, or simply from a non-accredited school?
It's Antietem College. Hit their site, check the FAQs, then tell me what you think.
And Tom, not to beat an already dead horse, but: in your corner bar you're among friends, people you can trust, people who will give you the benefit of the doubt.
I don't see many friendly faces around THIS watering hole.
4:03 -- It's Antietam College. Hit their site, check the FAQs, then tell me what you think.
I can't find the site for the life of me. I'm sure that when the Andrews Gang Bang started, I went to their site to see what the place was all about.
Anyway, here's what I think the general consensus was when I talked with the guys here:
Antietam is an ok place, not a diploma mill. It is not accredited, which isn't any major failing in itself; some places just don't go that way. A bit unusual, yes, but that's the way they are.
The D.Min. degree (Doctor of Ministry, the degree Frank has), is different from a Ph.D. The PhD is an academic research degree, used mostly for teaching and further research. The D.Min is a professional degree and you approach it in a whole different way.
I have a professional Master's degree, the M.Th. (Master of Theology), rather than the academic M.A. in Theology. I also have a s***load of credits beyond that, which I never applied toward the D.Min. that I don't want nor need.
I don't know the depth of Antietam's D.Min. program, but it's probably similar to other professional degrees offered by similar bible colleges. You put it after your name if you are in ministry, but probably would not if you are, let's say, teaching Comm in a college. You could, but it's not an academic degree as such.
I'll keep checking. But it's odd that I can't find it.
Is anyone else making posts that don't show up here? I sure don't think it's Howard, but I could swear I've posted this before - here it is again http://www.antietambiblecollege.org/
Sorry, you'll have to cut and paste, apparently blogger.com doesn't allow for HTML tags...
From all I can see off the web site, the college looks legit. I think the lack of federal $$ and general theological school accreditation may be because the school violates federal requirements regarding admittance to programs (women, for instance). This does not surprise me; they are strict Bible literalists.
I do not see what is required for their doctoral degree, so I can't comment on it. My guess is that it might be less than a PhD level, but still heavy on Biblical issues.
It definitely does not appear to be a diploma mill.
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